Curse

Jenn · Dec 01, 2006, 02:33 PM // 14:33

I think it's about time eles do what they're supposed to do.

The number of times I couldn't even get a group in PvE because there was an "un-nerfed" skill out there in another class that did MORE damage, whilst I'm supposed to be the biggest damage dealer in a single skill? Yeah.. it's about time we actually got some elite skills that can do damage. I got bored of playing ele in PvE because a) I either wasn't wanted b) I wasn't doing what I was hoping I'd be able to do when I signed up for that character class.

As for someone remarking, "it used to be the eles running away from asn/war" - well, it's payback time now, eh?

I'm tired of not being able to get off any spells because 9999% of our skills have a 50 second cast time, and cost 2000 energy to do reasonable damage. Elementalists are *very* easily countered IF they want to bring a mostly offensive build (and that's what we are - backline offense, not frontline defense).

Elemental Cotton · Dec 02, 2006, 02:24 AM // 02:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xpl0iter

you guys are forgetting that whiners don't have time to look at the counters, neither the history of the profession, nor its explanation.

^ Sad thing, it's true for 95% or 99% of the whiners.

Lord Cooper · Dec 02, 2006, 09:32 AM // 09:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alleji

Makes perfect sense. Counter a dead build, a dead build that sucked in the first place, and a scrub build that never made an impact outside of RA and AvA.

And in RA, a toucher will most likely own an ele 1v1... 115 armor vs fire much?

who takes fire into RA? too easy to interrupt too easy to avoid and not enough damage. air or water spike is the way to go in pvp imo.

the only fire build i play with is a particularly nasty degen build with mes secondary.. i can keep up 8 degen more or less indefinitely and still get in a minispike every few seconds. its slow but whole build totally ignores armour and annoys the hell out of pretty much everyone

Thom Bangalter · Dec 02, 2006, 06:54 PM // 18:54

I take fire into ra. Searing flames is really overpowered there, because a) people are dumb and will train people the entire match, and b) there are few monks, and fewer still that can keep up with that pressure.

Mysterial · Dec 02, 2006, 08:28 PM // 20:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom Bangalter

I take fire into ra. Searing flames is really overpowered there, because a) people are dumb and will train people the entire match, and b) there are few monks, and fewer still that can keep up with that pressure.

Searing Flames doesn't have particularly noteworthy pressure unless you're hitting multiple targets, so in 4v4 you're basically building to beat idiots. I'd rather build to beat the few smart people since those builds tend to beat the idiots down well enough, although perhaps not as spectacularly.

Thom Bangalter · Dec 02, 2006, 09:47 PM // 21:47

I'm not too concerned about facing smart people in RA, and the simple fact that I can annihilate 90% of the players there is fine by me.

Dutch Masterr · Dec 02, 2006, 10:40 PM // 22:40

i cant belive people are still posting on this =P

Thom Bangalter · Dec 02, 2006, 10:44 PM // 22:44

what else are people that like elementalists going to post about?

"heal party sure is good"

"yep, sure is."

Dutch Masterr · Dec 02, 2006, 10:51 PM // 22:51

screw fire eles---stoneflesh aura+mystic regeneration beats all =0

LightningHell · Dec 03, 2006, 10:32 AM // 10:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutch Masterr

screw fire eles---stoneflesh aura+mystic regeneration beats all =0

Ignoring you in battle beats all - losing Heal Party does, as well. XD

Francis Crawford · Dec 03, 2006, 11:28 AM // 11:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Strangelove

How on earth does winter help counter SF?

What it counters is Mark of Rodgort.

But then, while MoR is interesting in PvE, I have trouble imagining a good use for it in PvP.

Darkpower Alchemist · Dec 03, 2006, 12:29 PM // 12:29

SF, being the real topic of this thread,isn't overpowered and is quite counterable. A pyrebound Ranger Degen/Interupter will take a SF Ele with not much of a problem,IMO. Apply Poison+Burning Arrow+Savage Shot+ Screaming Shot=GG.

Bring a run skill with a Storm prefix and you may even get more out of an SF Ele than the SF Ele gets out of SF.

Symbol · Dec 03, 2006, 02:33 PM // 14:33

Quote:

Searing Flames doesn't have particularly noteworthy pressure unless you're hitting multiple targets, so in 4v4 you're basically building to beat idiots. I'd rather build to beat the few smart people since those builds tend to beat the idiots down well enough, although perhaps not as spectacularly.

Huh? Searing flames in an environment like RA is quite possibly the best pressure there is, given the frequency and intensity of the melee hate you encounter.

Mysterial · Dec 03, 2006, 04:06 PM // 16:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Symbol

Huh? Searing flames in an environment like RA is quite possibly the best pressure there is, given the frequency and intensity of the melee hate you encounter.

No, it isn't - Mind Blast will give you nearly the same single target damage and is both more versatile and more survivable. A Mind Shock or Mind Burn build can easily give you 60-70 DPS to a single target, frontloaded of course, but lasting longer than most arena matches do so the recovery is usually irrelevant.

Searing Flames is also extremely fragile (and since you often won't have a monk, those shatters and interrupts are most likely coming for you) and the build doesn't have the skill space for anything useful to do when it gets disabled.

It's not like I'm saying Searing Flames is terrible in arenas or anything, it's still a strong skill that will get you some wins, but I think there are better options.

Symbol · Dec 03, 2006, 05:53 PM // 17:53

Quote:

No, it isn't - Mind Blast will give you nearly the same single target damage and is both more versatile and more survivable. A Mind Shock or Mind Burn build can easily give you 60-70 DPS to a single target, frontloaded of course, but lasting longer than most arena matches do so the recovery is usually irrelevant.

I've played both mind blast and SF in arenas and the latter feels stronger to me. I agree that mind blast is comparable single target dps, but at least in RA you do get mileage out of the AoE allowing it completely outstrip mind blast in terms of damage.

In TA I'd probably go with melee for primary offense, so mind blast is more valuable for the utility it provides.

Quote:

A Mind Shock or Mind Burn build can easily give you 60-70 DPS to a single target, frontloaded of course, but lasting longer than most arena matches do so the recovery is usually irrelevant.

Mind burn and mind shock are nice when you're facing people with few/no self heals, but they fail badly if the battle lasts any significant amount of time. To me that isn't pressure-pressure is sustainable.

Quote:

Searing Flames is also extremely fragile (and since you often won't have a monk, those shatters and interrupts are most likely coming for you) and the build doesn't have the skill space for anything useful to do when it gets disabled.

Enchant removal is almost nonexistent in RA, and for good reason. You need those slots for self defense. Anywhere other than RA the fragility of SF would be a problem, but caster hate is rare and usually limited to the occasional backfire or migraine. Carry a blind (steam is nice) and physical interrupts (idiots spamming dshot/savage) become a non-issue.

Quote:

It's not like I'm saying Searing Flames is terrible in arenas or anything, it's still a strong skill that will get you some wins, but I think there are better options.

Depends on what you're going for. If it's to just win games quickly, mind shock and mind burn are attractive. But I think if you actually want to farm glad points or some such, searing flames is king, because of the raw damage it brings to the table.

Trylo · Dec 03, 2006, 08:30 PM // 20:30

uhh... i was HAing with a one of my builds, and i just brough extinguish. they lost within a minute. it was easy. flawless. yay?

You, in teh first place, should have extinguish for the poison/disease metagame pressure...

bring ward against elements or EVEN BETTER, ward against harm (the amazing skill)

Thom Bangalter · Dec 04, 2006, 03:28 AM // 03:28

any time anyone uses an elite skilll on ward against harm I cringe a little bit. And yeah, as I've been telling everyone who complains about searing flames, just run extinguish with around a 6 or 7 spec and even if they do get a couple off, the heal from extinguish bumps everyone above where they started.

LightningHell · Dec 04, 2006, 03:58 AM // 03:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom Bangalter

any time anyone uses an elite skilll on ward against harm I cringe a little bit. And yeah, as I've been telling everyone who complains about searing flames, just run extinguish with around a 6 or 7 spec and even if they do get a couple off, the heal from extinguish bumps everyone above where they started.

Heal Party also helps when Extinguish is down (for what? 8 seconds?)

Thom Bangalter · Dec 04, 2006, 04:35 AM // 04:35

it's on a 12 recharge, but if you're running extinguish you'll likely be running party, and then you get more efficency out of your extinguish this way, instead of extinguish followed by party.

bungusmaximus · Dec 04, 2006, 10:42 AM // 10:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

Ignoring you in battle beats all - losing Heal Party does, as well. XD

ROFL and qft. In alliance battles we always kill the rest first. You don't have to worry about damage when a char is stacked with defense only

.
Mystic regen is a kick ass skill though, but i use it together with dual attunements to counter degen, works like a charm. It's also a nice cover enchant. At least i have some room for offensive skills on my bar as well that way and i can spam them like crazy. I use air in PvP btw. cos I didn't get far with my SF ele, poor bugger got killed all the time...